News:

 

Topic: Confused about hard edges display  (Read 5022 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

  • No avatar
  • Posts: 976
  • Polygon
January 17, 2016, 11:48:32 pm
What's the difference between "Show Hard Edge Color$" and "Show Edge Harden/Soften Color"?
Previously we only had the first (well, without the dollar sign). Now it looks like we have two types of hard edges we can apply to a mesh because with "Show Hard Edge Color$" I cannot toggle hard edges display on and off. I had to use the "Show Edge Harden/Soften Color $".
There are even three colors related to hard edges (Hard Edge, Hard Edge2, Harden/Soften) in the Preferences.   :o

  • Posts: 1697
  • Administrator
  • Polygon
    • http://samardac.com/
January 18, 2016, 04:35:26 am
Show Hard Edge Color$ - will toggle show/hide hard edges,
Show Edge Harden/Soften Color - will show what edges you harden or soften manually*.
Hard Edge - Color of hard edges of selected objects
Hard Edge2 - Color of hard edges of unselected objects.
Also check, View - Object Shading - Preview on viewport Navigating.

*Use Crease Subdevision# basic SL tool to Harden/Soften edges. Drag to the left/right to make them hard or soft.

Also we have:
Select SubD Crease edges - will select all hard edges.
Grow selection within hard edge boundary - wil select Island bordered by hard edges.
Loop Select Hard edges - will select full hard edge.
P_Autosmooth Whole(*) - use it for automatic autosmooth.
Options - Hard Edge threshold Angle - will set threshold for creating hardges when you extrude. Autosmooth will over wright it anyway if you run it:)

NVil have the greatest tools to work with Hard edges!!
« Last Edit: January 18, 2016, 04:48:26 am by samardac »
Portfolio: www.samardac.com

  • No avatar
  • Posts: 976
  • Polygon
January 18, 2016, 12:46:10 pm
Show Hard Edge Color$ - will toggle show/hide hard edges,
Show Edge Harden/Soften Color - will show what edges you harden or soften manually*.
This is what I find confusing. ^

When I mark edges hard with "Edge Shortcut Tools->Harden/Soften Selected#" (I have it in a radial menu), the edges will be marked as hard. I can toggle visibility of those hard edges with "Rendering Options->Show Hard Edge Color". This works for me perfectly.

But yesterday I encountered hard edges (created automatically by NVil after some operation) for which the "Show Hard Edge Color" didn't work. I even couldn't soften them with "Harden/Soften Selected#" (by pressing #) or smoothing vertex normals. I did not use subd creases for the model. Then, I found this "Show Edge Harden/Soften Color" which worked and hid the hard edges from the view. I don't remember which tool I finally used to remove this peculiar type of hard edges, but they were very stubborn. ;)

  • Posts: 1697
  • Administrator
  • Polygon
    • http://samardac.com/
January 19, 2016, 03:28:32 pm
Use commands that I gave you and you will have no problems. Some commands for hard edges in NVil is outdated.
Also I forgot to say use commands:
Organic Flag -  it will make object organic, so no Hard edges will be available. Very good for organic objects.
Hard Edge flag - it will make object with Hard Edges, so you can handle them.
Also you can check the same checkbox when you create objects.
Portfolio: www.samardac.com

  • No avatar
  • Posts: 3705
  • Developer
  • Administrator
  • Polygon
January 20, 2016, 06:46:11 am
I just try to make it a little bit more easier to understand this issue.

Let's have a look at the "P_AutoSmooth_Whole" tool. Notice that it has a parameter,
IgnoreEdgeHardenSoftenFlag(bool)

Assume you set this parameter to true. When you use AutoSmooth tool to create hard edges, the result normally won't be 100% what you want. So you need to do some manual adjusting job to harden or soften some certain edges. If after that you keep working on the model and you want to do autosmooth again at some stage, this time, those harden/soften settings you did manually before will get lost and you have to do it again.

To prevent the manually set harden/soften edges from being lost when doing auto-smooth, you can set the parameter, IgnoreEdgeHardenSoftenFlag(bool), to false. When an edge is harden/soften manually, a harden or soften flag is assigned to the edge and this flag will tell the auto-smooth operation to leave this edge alone. And the two flags are represented by the colors which have confused you.

-------
samardec may have missed one tool

Edge Shortcut Tools > Clear Edge Harden/Soften Flags.

  • Posts: 1697
  • Administrator
  • Polygon
    • http://samardac.com/
January 20, 2016, 08:47:41 am
Yep, I also forget - Select Hard Not Sub Creased. I use it very often nice tool.
Portfolio: www.samardac.com

  • Posts: 1697
  • Administrator
  • Polygon
    • http://samardac.com/
January 20, 2016, 09:22:02 am
Summary about Hard Edges:

Colors:
- Hard Edge - Color of hard edges of selected objects
- Hard Edge2 - Color of hard edges of unselected objects.
- Edge Harden/Soften - Color of edges that was Harden/Soften Manually.

Shading:
- Show Hard Edge Color$ - will toggle show/hide hard edges,
- Show Edge Harden/Soften Color - will show what edges you harden or soften manually*.
- Object Shading -> Preview on viewport Navigating -> Show Hard Edges on preview. Enable Preview in the same menu to have nice shading when  you navigate viewport, you will see only hard edges.

Object Types:
- Organic Flag -  it will make object organic, so no Hard edges will be available. Very good for organic objects*.
- Hard Edge flag - it will make object with Hard Edges, so you can handle them*.
*Also you can check the same checkbox when you create objects.

Commands:
- Crease Subdevision# - basic SL tool to Harden/Soften edges. Drag to the left/right to make edges hard or soft.
- P_Autosmooth Whole(*) - use it for automatic autosmooth.
Set it like this:
Angle - 150
IgnoreEdgeHardenSoftenFlag - False
CreateUndoKey - False
Then set it to Shortcut Alt(Viewport Navigation) to make it work everytime you navigate viewport.
- Clear Edge Harden/Soften Flags (Clear Harden/Soften flags on object) use it to remove information about harden/soften flags.

Selection:
- Select SubD Crease edges - will select all hard edges.
- Grow selection within hard edge boundary - wil select Island bordered by hard edges.
- Loop Select Hard edges - will select full hard edge.
- Select Hard Not Sub Creased. Select hard edges that was not creased. Help to quickly convert hard edges to creased.

Options:
Options - Hard Edge threshold Angle - will set threshold for creating hardges when you extrude. Autosmooth will over wright it anyway if you run it:)
« Last Edit: January 20, 2016, 09:31:47 am by samardac »
Portfolio: www.samardac.com

  • No avatar
  • Posts: 976
  • Polygon
February 01, 2016, 10:26:44 pm
Thanks! That's a lot of information.
Can I permanently enable organic flag for all new objects?

  • Posts: 1697
  • Administrator
  • Polygon
    • http://samardac.com/
February 02, 2016, 07:33:21 am
Just check Organic check box wen you create new objects. It will remember its state.
Portfolio: www.samardac.com

  • No avatar
  • Posts: 976
  • Polygon
February 02, 2016, 01:07:58 pm
Just check Organic check box wen you create new objects. It will remember its state.
Ok, but I will need to mark this flag for each newly created object, unless it's been derived from an organic one (with split, duplication, etc.), am I correct?
Can I somehow permanently set organic flag (once and for all) for all objects created in NVil, so that each new object would automatically become organic?

  • Posts: 1697
  • Administrator
  • Polygon
    • http://samardac.com/
February 02, 2016, 01:10:45 pm
Set it once for every object (box, cylinder etc..) and forget about it  :)
Portfolio: www.samardac.com

  • No avatar
  • Posts: 976
  • Polygon
February 02, 2016, 01:13:44 pm
Set it once for every object (box, cylinder etc..) and forget about it  :)

Ah! I never noticed this. I was using Common Modelling Shortcut Tools->Set Object Organic Flag.
Thanks for the tip! :)

  • No avatar
  • Posts: 976
  • Polygon
February 09, 2016, 02:14:07 pm
Setting Organic Flag for an object doesn't prevent NVil from automatically creating hard edges.
Easily reproducible - create a cube, apply organic flag on it and start cutting one of its faces. Hard edges will start springing out like mushrooms after rain.

  • Posts: 1697
  • Administrator
  • Polygon
    • http://samardac.com/
February 09, 2016, 02:18:06 pm
Use autosmooth to correct it, now it is only solution. Set it to event action that will be perfomed on mouse releas after cutting. Or set it to alt or watether. Or just run it manually.
Portfolio: www.samardac.com

  • No avatar
  • Posts: 976
  • Polygon
February 09, 2016, 02:54:13 pm
Use autosmooth to correct it, now it is only solution. Set it to event action that will be perfomed on mouse releas after cutting (...)
Any advice on which specific command should I use and where to put it?

My streamline tool (subobjects) looks like this:
Options:
- NMB action enabled
- User event action enabled
- Allow event action on highlighted
Event Actions:
On Activated: Subobject Shortcut Tools >> Context Cut(BreakEdges)