NVil Forum
General Category => Community Help => Topic started by: Tiles on September 02, 2012, 07:53:49 am
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Is there a tool or method to quadrify (divide into quads) NGons? Triangulate is not always what i want. And manually adding the missing edges is a bit cumbersome :)
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Hi Tiles,
Basic streamline tool "Make Quad". You will need to set up a streamline tool for that.
The "Make Quad" is under the streamline "Polygon Tools"
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Thanks Steve, will give it a go :)
EDIT, nope, doesn`t work. I´ve created a new streamline tool, habe setup a hotkey, On Activated / Polygon Shortcut Tools >> Make Quad Concave. Then i selected a NGon, have hit my hotkey, and the Ngon stays a NGon. Hm.
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Tiles, Do you really what 'Make Quad Concave' does?
There two tools you can use
- Geometry > Common Tools n Commands > Quad Cap. You need to delete the ngon first. And some selections are required for defining the quad formation.
- StreamLine Basic Tools > Polygon Tools > Make Quad. This tool is more flexible. It works on polygon selections. You can change the quad formation by some key operations while the tool is still live. Note: You don't have '+'/'-" key on you german keyboard. But you can check with the original keychart layout to find out which keys they are in your keyboard. They are the two keys next to the '0' key to the right.
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>> Make Quad Concave.
I stated, use "Make Quad", not "Make Quad concave", that is a different tool.
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Ouch :D
My mistake was that i didn`t find a make quad for the event actions. So i thought that "Make Quad concave" was meant. Got it working now. Thanks for the help :)
Hm, this make quad is a bit different from what i wanted to do. It crosses the edges and adds vertices. Not that this result is bad. But i want to divide the current NGon into quads only, not adding more geometry. Like i would divide it into tris. Just with quads. Is there also a solution?
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But i want to divide the current NGon into quads only, not adding more geometry. Like i would divide it into tris. Just with quads. Is there also a solution?
Not sure what you mean. Have you an example?
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Could just dot it by hand, with brodge, cap and the connect tools. Since the app will never know exactly what you want.
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Model by hand is not always an option because with for example a 20k terrain it is very cumbersome ;)
I mean simply quadrify the ngon, like you would triangulate the ngon. Just with quad results instead tri results :)
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ah i was thinking of it as in props and subd work, where a quaddrify command would never get the edge flow the user wanted, but in the case of terrian i see how usefull it would be.
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Hi Tiles,
That n-gon is quite complex. I see it is currently filled with quads and tri`s. Is there a programme that can fill that [n-gon] with just quads in a way you have described/want?
I think there can be issues with over_lapping polygon creation.
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For some n-gons, did you notice the options within the "make-Quad" tool?
Quick example:-
(see pic)
Far left: Original tri face
middle: Default "Make_Quad"
Right: While "make_Quad" active, press "+/-" key to change construct.
(http://i.imgur.com/cX0Gh.jpg)
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Is there a programme that can fill that [n-gon] with just quads in a way you have described/want?
Nope, because with uneven vertices count you will always end in a tri. But tris and quads as shown in the shot is possible. The shot is from trueSpace. I`ve filled the Ngon with quads and tris with the quadrify tool there.
The algorythm can of course not decide what special geometry you want. All it does is to start at one point, and fill in quads from there. Better said, it uses the underlying triangulation, and leaves away every second edge. Means you may need to fix your geometry here and there afterwards.
It`s nevertheless a very neat time saver that i don`t want to miss anymore :)
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For some n-gons, did you notice the options within the "make-Quad" tool?
Quick example:-
(see pic)
Far left: Original tri face
middle: Default "Make_Quad"
Right: While "make_Quad" active, press "+/-" key to change construct.
Hm, cannot get this one to work. I haven`t found the makequad command in any menu yet. But i`ve hotkeyed it. Unfortunately i cannot hold down my hotkey, click with the mouse, and also reach the plus button. I would need a third hand.
What i did was to activate the makequad tool in the Smart tips with selected Ngon. When i click at the Ngon it turns into the quad geometry. But even here it doesn`t help to press + or - to change the mode. It always creates the same geometry, adding vertices at the cutting points.
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Is there a programme that can fill that [n-gon] with just quads in a way you have described/want?
Nope, because with uneven vertices count you will always end in a tri. But tris and quads as shown in the shot is possible. The shot is from trueSpace. I`ve filled the Ngon with quads and tris with the quadrify tool there.
The algorythm can of course not decide what special geometry you want. All it does is to start at one point, and fill in quads from there. Better said, it uses the underlying triangulation, and leaves away every second edge. Means you may need to fix your geometry here and there afterwards.
It`s nevertheless a very neat time saver that i don`t want to miss anymore :)
Can you make a video to show me how truepace does it?
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There isn`t really something to show that`s worth to record the process. I select all faces, or just the Ngon, and simply hit the quadrify button.
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But tris and quads as shown in the shot is possible. The shot is from trueSpace. I`ve filled the Ngon with quads and tris with the quadrify tool there.
OK, I will have a look.
I was one of the unfortunates who purchased the latest Truespace just before they sold the technology to MS (Christmas sale), I purchased the VRay plugin as well lol
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Hm, cannot get this one to work. I haven`t found the makequad command in any menu yet. But i`ve hotkeyed it. Unfortunately i cannot hold down my hotkey, click with the mouse, and also reach the plus button. I would need a third hand.
What i did was to activate the makequad tool in the Smart tips with selected Ngon. When i click at the Ngon it turns into the quad geometry. But even here it doesn`t help to press + or - to change the mode. It always creates the same geometry, adding vertices at the cutting points.
Set up a Streamline tool.
In the Streamline Customize window, the "Basic Streamline Tool" should be set in one of the top 6 entries. Place the "Make Quad" in the "NMB Tool"(No Mouse button). When you then press the shortcut key. the "Make quad" will create/rotate the geometry while the mouse is moving.
The +/- keys are not the ones on the num_pad, but along the top. You may need to remap them if you use a different keyboard layout.
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The +/- keys are not the ones on the num_pad, but along the top.
Thanks Steve, this should lead me into the right direction. German keyboard layout ... :)
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Tiles, I don't think the result of quadrify in the pic is close to what you actually want. It is just a mess.
I can make a tool that can create quads with better result. But it will only work in grid style quad mesh like the one in the pic.
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I don't think the result of quadrify in the pic is close to what you actually want. It is just a mess.
I would not describe it as a mess, but would not (since naming appears to be so important at times) call the tool that created it a "Quadify" tool, given the results are not all quads.
There is a tool in Wings3d "Tesselate-> Quadrangulate", which although a strange name, does better describe a tessellation tool giving a result of a mixture of quads+tri`s.
This is the result on (similar shape) n-gon with that wing3d tool:-
(http://i.imgur.com/wQoMD.jpg)
Now for a mess, unfortunately the results from triangulating that same n-gon in Nvil will currently result in overlapping polygons.
(http://i.imgur.com/Q47G1.jpg)
Although I do not normally find myself in such a situation with such an n-gon, any improvement on the result in Nvil would be welcomed (and maybe you could add such improvement to the underlying triangulation used for Nvil display)
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I would not describe it as a mess, but would not (since naming appears to be so important at times) call the tool that created it a "Quadify" tool, given the results are not all quads.
The main purpose of this tool is simply to eliminate any NGons at a mesh. And is exactly what i want. It turns a NGon mesh into a Quad and Tris Mesh by selecting all faces and hitting the "quadrify" button. So quadrify isn`t this bad as a name. Quadrangulate isn`t this bad neither. You can also call it Split NGon. or divide NGon into quads and tris. I`m green with everything that describes the function of the tool in a proper way.
The result is also in Wings 3D as messy as the underlying triangulation. Seems that Wings does a better job with the optimization here. And also in Nvil, as shown by Steve :)
The problem with grid style quad mesh is that it adds extra geometry. But that`s usually why i introduce big NGons at all. To get rid of the extra geometry, to eliminate not necessary vertices. To make the mesh smaller :)
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Hi Tiles,
I am just curious.
When TrueSpace re-builds the n-gons with quads/tri`s, does it allow non-planer quads to be created? or does it triangulate to remove those?
(I was going to have a look at TS to check, but it is on a backup DVD somewhere I cannot find at the moment)
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It does. It uses the underlying triangulated geometry. And when this geometry is non planar, then it creates of course non planar quads.
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Done.